1 00:00:22,960 --> 00:00:09,110 welcome to the skeptic zone the podcast 2 00:00:32,060 --> 00:00:26,710 yes it's the skeptic zone episode number 3 00:00:36,010 --> 00:00:32,070 192 for the 23rd of jun 2012 Richard 4 00:00:40,549 --> 00:00:36,020 Saunders here with you from a very funny 5 00:00:42,200 --> 00:00:40,559 very clear but chilly Sydney Australia 6 00:00:45,319 --> 00:00:42,210 just the other day we had the winter 7 00:00:48,860 --> 00:00:45,329 solstice I seem to have heard the 8 00:00:51,970 --> 00:00:48,870 shortest day of the year oh look so nice 9 00:00:54,590 --> 00:00:51,980 outside the window just cool and crisp 10 00:00:56,689 --> 00:00:54,600 but let's get on to this week's episode 11 00:00:59,029 --> 00:00:56,699 of the skeptics own this is the Reader's 12 00:01:02,319 --> 00:00:59,039 Digest version today the cut price to 13 00:01:05,450 --> 00:01:02,329 cut down the streamlined the streamlined 14 00:01:08,090 --> 00:01:05,460 it's only half a show in fact it's only 15 00:01:10,370 --> 00:01:08,100 half a show we had a technical problem 16 00:01:12,080 --> 00:01:10,380 some interviews are sort of hiding on a 17 00:01:14,660 --> 00:01:12,090 chip somewhere we're trying to Winkle 18 00:01:17,810 --> 00:01:14,670 them out but for this week we only have 19 00:01:19,969 --> 00:01:17,820 about 30 minutes or so of the skeptic 20 00:01:23,390 --> 00:01:19,979 zone I hope you don't mind the slightly 21 00:01:25,730 --> 00:01:23,400 shorter version but as always I hope 22 00:01:27,920 --> 00:01:25,740 you'll find the show interesting are we 23 00:01:32,120 --> 00:01:27,930 going to kick off with an interview i 24 00:01:35,330 --> 00:01:32,130 did with ash price from n brew scotland 25 00:01:38,899 --> 00:01:35,340 ash price is a street performer a 26 00:01:40,700 --> 00:01:38,909 magician the public speaker and a 27 00:01:42,830 --> 00:01:40,710 skeptic in fact he founded scotland's 28 00:01:45,080 --> 00:01:42,840 first skeptics in the pub he is going to 29 00:01:48,620 --> 00:01:45,090 tell us he's going to tell us about 30 00:01:50,600 --> 00:01:48,630 ghosty tours in scotland and an upcoming 31 00:01:54,560 --> 00:01:50,610 performance he's giving all about 32 00:01:57,020 --> 00:01:54,570 psychic trickery ah scotland edinburgh 33 00:02:00,080 --> 00:01:57,030 what a lovely city that is after the 34 00:02:01,760 --> 00:02:00,090 break it's penny chan with a penny for 35 00:02:04,010 --> 00:02:01,770 your thoughts and penny is going to be 36 00:02:06,260 --> 00:02:04,020 interviewing Wendy and Paula from the 37 00:02:10,760 --> 00:02:06,270 independent investigations group in 38 00:02:13,140 --> 00:02:10,770 Hollywood iig just a week ago the 39 00:02:17,429 --> 00:02:13,150 independent investigations group 40 00:02:19,770 --> 00:02:17,439 tested gave a test for their $50,000 41 00:02:23,759 --> 00:02:19,780 prize a guy by the name of Robert 42 00:02:26,399 --> 00:02:23,769 Moreland who claimed he could see 43 00:02:28,289 --> 00:02:26,409 photographs in hidden envelopes or 44 00:02:30,449 --> 00:02:28,299 hidden photographs in envelopes off I 45 00:02:33,720 --> 00:02:30,459 think you understand what I mean now on 46 00:02:36,990 --> 00:02:33,730 the web page www skeptic zone TV you can 47 00:02:41,399 --> 00:02:37,000 click the link and read all about the 48 00:02:43,530 --> 00:02:41,409 the test Wendy and Paula tell penny Chan 49 00:02:45,539 --> 00:02:43,540 all about the test how hard it was to 50 00:02:48,479 --> 00:02:45,549 set up and some of the interesting 51 00:02:51,990 --> 00:02:48,489 claims that Robert Moreland was making 52 00:02:56,819 --> 00:02:52,000 and to relieve you of any suspense he 53 00:02:58,399 --> 00:02:56,829 didn't pass the test oh well thank you 54 00:03:01,319 --> 00:02:58,409 for those people who are sending in 55 00:03:03,390 --> 00:03:01,329 limericks for our Limerick competition I 56 00:03:05,940 --> 00:03:03,400 it's going to be running for one more 57 00:03:08,129 --> 00:03:05,950 week the idea is that if you send out in 58 00:03:10,710 --> 00:03:08,139 a limerick with a Merrow religious-based 59 00:03:13,170 --> 00:03:10,720 sort of theme to it we're going to judge 60 00:03:15,360 --> 00:03:13,180 the best one or the one that we find the 61 00:03:18,150 --> 00:03:15,370 funniest I guess or maybe we'll just 62 00:03:20,220 --> 00:03:18,160 pick one out of that this one is right 63 00:03:24,330 --> 00:03:20,230 on my screen at the moment from Jason 64 00:03:27,360 --> 00:03:24,340 let's see we all know the story of Job 65 00:03:29,490 --> 00:03:27,370 he was the best man on the globe even 66 00:03:32,220 --> 00:03:29,500 though he had slaves with his kids in 67 00:03:37,170 --> 00:03:32,230 their graves he loved God and tore off 68 00:03:39,170 --> 00:03:37,180 his robe hmm okay kiddan coming we've 69 00:03:41,309 --> 00:03:39,180 got quite a few lyrics coming in with a 70 00:03:42,839 --> 00:03:41,319 religious sort of based theme maybe we 71 00:03:47,479 --> 00:03:42,849 should have fun with Buddha in and there 72 00:03:50,039 --> 00:03:47,489 once was a guy called Boehner who yeah 73 00:03:51,420 --> 00:03:50,049 nothing about that for a while but 74 00:03:53,430 --> 00:03:51,430 enough for that I'm going to run 75 00:03:55,110 --> 00:03:53,440 downstairs have that lovely hot cup of 76 00:03:58,559 --> 00:03:55,120 chocolate hot chocolate for a cold 77 00:04:15,880 --> 00:03:58,569 winter's day and let you enjoy the 78 00:04:22,460 --> 00:04:18,500 and joining me now on the line from 79 00:04:24,409 --> 00:04:22,470 Scotland is ash price hello ash I could 80 00:04:26,330 --> 00:04:24,419 evening good evening and good morning to 81 00:04:28,940 --> 00:04:26,340 you i think it is a Miss crazy world of 82 00:04:31,520 --> 00:04:28,950 time zones yes it is exactly with my 83 00:04:33,290 --> 00:04:31,530 morning coffee well I've just had my 84 00:04:35,570 --> 00:04:33,300 afternoon tea so we're sort of kindred 85 00:04:37,010 --> 00:04:35,580 spirits in that respect and I think 86 00:04:39,260 --> 00:04:37,020 we're kindred spirits and more within 87 00:04:41,150 --> 00:04:39,270 one way because I was just having a 88 00:04:42,860 --> 00:04:41,160 quick look at your your various websites 89 00:04:45,650 --> 00:04:42,870 and things happening on the internet and 90 00:04:48,350 --> 00:04:45,660 I noticed that you are the founder of 91 00:04:49,340 --> 00:04:48,360 scotland's first skeptics in the pub and 92 00:04:51,440 --> 00:04:49,350 I thought that was quite a coincidence 93 00:04:53,870 --> 00:04:51,450 because many years ago I founded Sydney 94 00:04:58,430 --> 00:04:53,880 skeptics in the pub what prompted you to 95 00:05:00,560 --> 00:04:58,440 do to do that oh well scholars got a bit 96 00:05:02,540 --> 00:05:00,570 of a reputation for hauntings and the 97 00:05:04,850 --> 00:05:02,550 supernatural and I used to work for 98 00:05:07,490 --> 00:05:04,860 ghosts or I'm a performing artist by 99 00:05:08,930 --> 00:05:07,500 trade and most performing artists in 100 00:05:11,000 --> 00:05:08,940 Edinburgh one stage will work for the 101 00:05:13,580 --> 00:05:11,010 ghost tours I was there for a few years 102 00:05:15,530 --> 00:05:13,590 and when I started working for the ghost 103 00:05:17,360 --> 00:05:15,540 tours I wouldn't call myself skeptical 104 00:05:19,280 --> 00:05:17,370 individual by over the time working 105 00:05:22,310 --> 00:05:19,290 there I did develop more of a skeptical 106 00:05:24,650 --> 00:05:22,320 mindset and I started working on a 107 00:05:27,020 --> 00:05:24,660 skeptical Ghost Walk and when I was 108 00:05:28,580 --> 00:05:27,030 doing that I contacted a few but if 109 00:05:30,620 --> 00:05:28,590 skeptic one of them was Chris French and 110 00:05:31,730 --> 00:05:30,630 he suggested I set up a skeptics and the 111 00:05:33,890 --> 00:05:31,740 pub's try and meet more like-minded 112 00:05:35,630 --> 00:05:33,900 individuals so that's kind of where that 113 00:05:37,219 --> 00:05:35,640 started from it was actually a ghost 114 00:05:39,830 --> 00:05:37,229 tour that gave rise to scotland's first 115 00:05:42,200 --> 00:05:39,840 skeptics in the pub so there you go the 116 00:05:44,180 --> 00:05:42,210 ghosts the ghost of Scotland the ghost 117 00:05:46,190 --> 00:05:44,190 of Edinburgh led to scotland's first 118 00:05:48,950 --> 00:05:46,200 skeptics in the pub well I certainly 119 00:05:51,469 --> 00:05:48,960 enjoy doing and going to skeptics in the 120 00:05:53,180 --> 00:05:51,479 pub and on what a wonderful time I had 121 00:05:55,040 --> 00:05:53,190 in Edinburgh a couple of months ago when 122 00:05:57,860 --> 00:05:55,050 I was visiting and speaking at skeptics 123 00:06:00,560 --> 00:05:57,870 in the pub and sadly you weren't you 124 00:06:02,120 --> 00:06:00,570 didn't make that one no I couldn't go 125 00:06:03,380 --> 00:06:02,130 along to that one I'm hadn't been very 126 00:06:06,860 --> 00:06:03,390 well earlier in the year so I 127 00:06:08,570 --> 00:06:06,870 unfortunately missed a few talks but I i 128 00:06:10,670 --> 00:06:08,580 agree view it's fantastic going along to 129 00:06:12,740 --> 00:06:10,680 them and since we started back in two 130 00:06:15,350 --> 00:06:12,750 thousand nine including all the special 131 00:06:16,320 --> 00:06:15,360 events we've done we've done well over 132 00:06:18,420 --> 00:06:16,330 100 133 00:06:21,510 --> 00:06:18,430 different talks and shows in the past 134 00:06:23,909 --> 00:06:21,520 three years I I did actually one state 135 00:06:26,189 --> 00:06:23,919 worker Hammond we done and it was it it 136 00:06:29,040 --> 00:06:26,199 was around 150 marks we've done quite a 137 00:06:30,600 --> 00:06:29,050 lot of events ranging from regular 138 00:06:33,809 --> 00:06:30,610 skeptics in the pub talks to 139 00:06:36,899 --> 00:06:33,819 family-friendly events to walking tours 140 00:06:38,760 --> 00:06:36,909 and all sorts of different things that 141 00:06:40,529 --> 00:06:38,770 we've staged for our for our membership 142 00:06:42,300 --> 00:06:40,539 so it's been absolutely fantastic was 143 00:06:45,300 --> 00:06:42,310 always something on him I think now we 144 00:06:48,420 --> 00:06:45,310 do about five events a month all right 145 00:06:50,640 --> 00:06:48,430 now just so listeners in Scotland just 146 00:06:52,379 --> 00:06:50,650 deduct to make doubly sure if they want 147 00:06:55,619 --> 00:06:52,389 to go to skeptics in the pub what's the 148 00:06:57,480 --> 00:06:55,629 best web address they can head to just 149 00:06:58,980 --> 00:06:57,490 go to edible skeptics topcoat UK they'll 150 00:07:01,379 --> 00:06:58,990 take you to our website and there's a 151 00:07:04,110 --> 00:07:01,389 full list of all of our events from our 152 00:07:06,200 --> 00:07:04,120 book club to our coffee shop meetings to 153 00:07:08,490 --> 00:07:06,210 regular skeptics in the pub talks 154 00:07:09,839 --> 00:07:08,500 fantastic now apart from that of course 155 00:07:12,149 --> 00:07:09,849 you're mentioning earlier you're a 156 00:07:14,339 --> 00:07:12,159 performance artist performing artist and 157 00:07:17,429 --> 00:07:14,349 a magician into magic which is a great 158 00:07:19,559 --> 00:07:17,439 background for any skeptic I think you 159 00:07:22,170 --> 00:07:19,569 sound like you sort of have a varying a 160 00:07:24,719 --> 00:07:22,180 varying interests in life what do you 161 00:07:29,010 --> 00:07:24,729 how would you categorize yourself first 162 00:07:30,749 --> 00:07:29,020 and foremost um performing artist I I 163 00:07:32,519 --> 00:07:30,759 didn't used to use that phrase because I 164 00:07:35,100 --> 00:07:32,529 always used to think performing artists 165 00:07:36,839 --> 00:07:35,110 sounds a little bit pretentious but I 166 00:07:38,969 --> 00:07:36,849 realized that it really does describe 167 00:07:42,029 --> 00:07:38,979 what is I do because I as I said I do 168 00:07:43,529 --> 00:07:42,039 have a varied outlook on life and 169 00:07:45,959 --> 00:07:43,539 various different performances and 170 00:07:49,110 --> 00:07:45,969 performance styles come into it from 171 00:07:51,570 --> 00:07:49,120 magic to public speaking to acting 172 00:07:53,129 --> 00:07:51,580 directing so the easiest way to describe 173 00:07:54,629 --> 00:07:53,139 herself is performing artist of course 174 00:07:56,249 --> 00:07:54,639 then I have to explain what I mean by 175 00:08:00,329 --> 00:07:56,259 performing artists so I don't know if a 176 00:08:01,980 --> 00:08:00,339 is a time saver well I suppose it covers 177 00:08:03,450 --> 00:08:01,990 a multitude of things doesn't it you see 178 00:08:04,769 --> 00:08:03,460 if you're performing artists where you 179 00:08:06,869 --> 00:08:04,779 can sort of get away with all sorts of 180 00:08:08,730 --> 00:08:06,879 things including being a magician which 181 00:08:10,559 --> 00:08:08,740 is good to see and I was quite 182 00:08:15,629 --> 00:08:10,569 interested to have a look at your your 183 00:08:21,839 --> 00:08:15,639 website which is ash price co uk that's 184 00:08:23,279 --> 00:08:21,849 a sh p ry CEO UK and you've got some 185 00:08:25,829 --> 00:08:23,289 videos they're doing something like 186 00:08:28,999 --> 00:08:25,839 psychic surgery and also somewhat 187 00:08:32,569 --> 00:08:29,009 debunking other so-called paranormal 188 00:08:35,000 --> 00:08:32,579 all abilities yes so the the some videos 189 00:08:37,699 --> 00:08:35,010 on the site and I'm looking at different 190 00:08:41,259 --> 00:08:37,709 types of telekinetic and psychic power 191 00:08:44,089 --> 00:08:41,269 normal claims one of my favorites 192 00:08:46,699 --> 00:08:44,099 telekinetic supernatural claims was by 193 00:08:48,410 --> 00:08:46,709 James Heydrich who was who is an 194 00:08:51,530 --> 00:08:48,420 American chap and back in the early 80s 195 00:08:53,780 --> 00:08:51,540 he shot to fame by being up to move or 196 00:08:55,699 --> 00:08:53,790 claimed he was able to move pencils and 197 00:08:58,069 --> 00:08:55,709 phonebook pages using the power of his 198 00:08:59,689 --> 00:08:58,079 mind and he was doing the chat show 199 00:09:02,750 --> 00:08:59,699 circuit and he got quite a reputation 200 00:09:04,129 --> 00:09:02,760 for himself until a little known skeptic 201 00:09:08,030 --> 00:09:04,139 by the name of I think his name is James 202 00:09:09,650 --> 00:09:08,040 Randi yes yeah yeah I I don't know if 203 00:09:13,490 --> 00:09:09,660 many many of Ulysses may have heard him 204 00:09:15,949 --> 00:09:13,500 but you know yeah so James does what 205 00:09:17,569 --> 00:09:15,959 James Randi does best and on a 206 00:09:18,860 --> 00:09:17,579 television show i think it was i think 207 00:09:21,470 --> 00:09:18,870 that's entertainment or that's 208 00:09:22,910 --> 00:09:21,480 incredible he explained exactly how 209 00:09:24,710 --> 00:09:22,920 James heydrich was doing it and all 210 00:09:26,090 --> 00:09:24,720 James [\h__\h] was doing to move the pencil 211 00:09:28,059 --> 00:09:26,100 with his mind and to move the phone book 212 00:09:30,379 --> 00:09:28,069 page with his mind was to blow on it and 213 00:09:33,530 --> 00:09:30,389 so that's I see one of my favorite 214 00:09:34,970 --> 00:09:33,540 alleged psychic tricks and it it still 215 00:09:38,150 --> 00:09:34,980 gets people and that's what I love about 216 00:09:40,939 --> 00:09:38,160 it that even though this is 30 years old 217 00:09:43,939 --> 00:09:40,949 this this claim this psychic ability 218 00:09:45,769 --> 00:09:43,949 that Heydrich was doing it still gets 219 00:09:47,930 --> 00:09:45,779 people and so it still does need 220 00:09:51,650 --> 00:09:47,940 explaining same with a metal bending as 221 00:09:52,939 --> 00:09:51,660 well people still do believe that is 222 00:09:55,220 --> 00:09:52,949 possible to bend metal with a power of 223 00:09:56,600 --> 00:09:55,230 your mind so it's still important that 224 00:09:58,069 --> 00:09:56,610 we're exposing this and it's still 225 00:10:00,170 --> 00:09:58,079 important we're showing people exactly 226 00:10:02,059 --> 00:10:00,180 how it's done by pre bending the spoon 227 00:10:06,170 --> 00:10:02,069 to weaken the neck at for the 228 00:10:08,600 --> 00:10:06,180 performance absolutely and yes I known 229 00:10:10,879 --> 00:10:08,610 about D James Heydrich videos and story 230 00:10:14,000 --> 00:10:10,889 for quite some time in fact I've had a 231 00:10:15,800 --> 00:10:14,010 little chat to james randi about it many 232 00:10:17,090 --> 00:10:15,810 years ago we were chatting about that 233 00:10:19,730 --> 00:10:17,100 very thing but the important thing to 234 00:10:22,309 --> 00:10:19,740 notice of course what's a note is that 235 00:10:26,050 --> 00:10:22,319 when you do it when he was doing it all 236 00:10:29,990 --> 00:10:26,060 those years ago it's not just blowing on 237 00:10:31,550 --> 00:10:30,000 something you do it very subtly and very 238 00:10:34,250 --> 00:10:31,560 carefully in James Heydrich had an 239 00:10:36,439 --> 00:10:34,260 amazing ability to blow air out of his 240 00:10:39,019 --> 00:10:36,449 lungs and have nothing appearing on his 241 00:10:40,910 --> 00:10:39,029 face you'd never know oh he's absolutely 242 00:10:44,210 --> 00:10:40,920 fantastic um 243 00:10:45,560 --> 00:10:44,220 is very very good at what he does which 244 00:10:48,139 --> 00:10:45,570 is one of the reasons why he was so 245 00:10:50,960 --> 00:10:48,149 convincing there was a one one event 246 00:10:52,460 --> 00:10:50,970 where a chat show host thought you may 247 00:10:54,530 --> 00:10:52,470 have been blowing on the pencil so put 248 00:10:57,199 --> 00:10:54,540 his hand over James hydrex mouth to stop 249 00:10:59,000 --> 00:10:57,209 him and Heydrich still managed to move 250 00:11:01,310 --> 00:10:59,010 the pencil white is in this situation 251 00:11:02,600 --> 00:11:01,320 was he balanced a pencil very very very 252 00:11:04,759 --> 00:11:02,610 carefully on the edge of a table and 253 00:11:06,560 --> 00:11:04,769 simply use the air currents of his hands 254 00:11:09,530 --> 00:11:06,570 to be able to move the pencil so he had 255 00:11:11,329 --> 00:11:09,540 a backup in case and on did think he was 256 00:11:13,250 --> 00:11:11,339 blowing on it I'm so he was able to 257 00:11:14,689 --> 00:11:13,260 still recreate it of course he wasn't 258 00:11:16,790 --> 00:11:14,699 able to do this with the phone book so 259 00:11:18,740 --> 00:11:16,800 as soon as James Randi put styrofoam 260 00:11:20,660 --> 00:11:18,750 pieces around the base of the phone book 261 00:11:22,639 --> 00:11:20,670 so I even the slightest gust of air 262 00:11:24,650 --> 00:11:22,649 would move the styrofoam James Heydrich 263 00:11:26,540 --> 00:11:24,660 couldn't move the book the other thing 264 00:11:29,360 --> 00:11:26,550 about James Heydrich is a he is one of 265 00:11:30,769 --> 00:11:29,370 the few psychics or alleged psychics who 266 00:11:32,210 --> 00:11:30,779 has actually come at a later stage and 267 00:11:34,610 --> 00:11:32,220 said yes I was doing through trickery 268 00:11:35,930 --> 00:11:34,620 and a few years after he was exposed he 269 00:11:37,759 --> 00:11:35,940 didn't do an interview with a journalist 270 00:11:39,680 --> 00:11:37,769 and said yep I was just blowing on it I 271 00:11:41,269 --> 00:11:39,690 learned this ability whilst I was in 272 00:11:44,780 --> 00:11:41,279 prison and one of the things he used to 273 00:11:46,430 --> 00:11:44,790 do was have little Bible groups and he'd 274 00:11:49,060 --> 00:11:46,440 moved the pages of the Bible convincing 275 00:11:52,340 --> 00:11:49,070 people the power of Christ was was there 276 00:11:55,519 --> 00:11:52,350 absolutely and what would a a good thing 277 00:11:56,750 --> 00:11:55,529 it is for all of us as all those videos 278 00:11:58,639 --> 00:11:56,760 or many of them of course we're 279 00:12:01,220 --> 00:11:58,649 available online if people just Google 280 00:12:03,019 --> 00:12:01,230 James Heydrich James Randi James 281 00:12:04,759 --> 00:12:03,029 Heydrich telekinesis they'll find all 282 00:12:07,730 --> 00:12:04,769 that information there it's fantastic to 283 00:12:10,639 --> 00:12:07,740 see it now apart from that I was quite 284 00:12:11,750 --> 00:12:10,649 tickled to see that you have started up 285 00:12:13,780 --> 00:12:11,760 something or you're involved with 286 00:12:16,550 --> 00:12:13,790 something called the beginner's guide to 287 00:12:19,210 --> 00:12:16,560 psychic trickery now that's something 288 00:12:22,040 --> 00:12:19,220 you're aiming to do pretty soon isn't it 289 00:12:23,870 --> 00:12:22,050 yes that's during this year's Adam 290 00:12:26,030 --> 00:12:23,880 Fringe Festival the beginner's guide to 291 00:12:28,519 --> 00:12:26,040 psychic trickery is its really three 292 00:12:30,889 --> 00:12:28,529 shows one of them is called how to be a 293 00:12:32,660 --> 00:12:30,899 psychic con man which is looking more 294 00:12:34,430 --> 00:12:32,670 telekinesis telepathy mind-reading 295 00:12:36,470 --> 00:12:34,440 because the important thing to remember 296 00:12:38,420 --> 00:12:36,480 of course is psychic doesn't just refer 297 00:12:39,949 --> 00:12:38,430 to two mediumship and communicating with 298 00:12:41,329 --> 00:12:39,959 the dead I'm talking to the deads 299 00:12:45,170 --> 00:12:41,339 actually really easy to do it's getting 300 00:12:46,730 --> 00:12:45,180 them to talk back that's hot but a lot 301 00:12:48,350 --> 00:12:46,740 of psychic ability also covers so 302 00:12:50,150 --> 00:12:48,360 telepathy telekinesis so you've got 303 00:12:51,980 --> 00:12:50,160 metal bending you've got ESP you've got 304 00:12:52,410 --> 00:12:51,990 psychic surgery you've got the gift of 305 00:12:54,389 --> 00:12:52,420 prof 306 00:12:56,310 --> 00:12:54,399 see as all these come into psychic 307 00:12:58,800 --> 00:12:56,320 ability as well so how to be a psychic 308 00:13:00,780 --> 00:12:58,810 con man we'll look at those then there's 309 00:13:02,610 --> 00:13:00,790 how to predict the future which is a bit 310 00:13:04,560 --> 00:13:02,620 more focused on on prophecy so it's 311 00:13:06,660 --> 00:13:04,570 looking at phrenology which is reading 312 00:13:09,439 --> 00:13:06,670 the bumps in the head to be able to tell 313 00:13:12,990 --> 00:13:09,449 insight about someone and looking at 314 00:13:14,639 --> 00:13:13,000 astrology and then there's a new one 315 00:13:17,160 --> 00:13:14,649 called how to talk to dead which I've 316 00:13:18,569 --> 00:13:17,170 not performed for how to talk how did if 317 00:13:20,670 --> 00:13:18,579 I could come an apt in a couple of times 318 00:13:23,460 --> 00:13:20,680 and how to put it the future I'd trialed 319 00:13:25,050 --> 00:13:23,470 out in Aberdeen last month but how to 320 00:13:27,629 --> 00:13:25,060 talk to birds a completely brand new one 321 00:13:30,480 --> 00:13:27,639 and it's looking at victorian seances 322 00:13:33,629 --> 00:13:30,490 and how those tricks could still be used 323 00:13:35,150 --> 00:13:33,639 today so different types of slate 324 00:13:36,720 --> 00:13:35,160 writing the Victorians used to use 325 00:13:38,280 --> 00:13:36,730 different tricks they used to 326 00:13:40,019 --> 00:13:38,290 incorporate into their seances and of 327 00:13:41,670 --> 00:13:40,029 course looking at the origins of the of 328 00:13:44,759 --> 00:13:41,680 the séances and spiritualism which 329 00:13:46,970 --> 00:13:44,769 worthy the Fox sisters in America I mums 330 00:13:49,860 --> 00:13:46,980 you sort of made me feel a bit 331 00:13:51,569 --> 00:13:49,870 disappointed now because when I still 332 00:13:53,879 --> 00:13:51,579 think of all the psychics and the 333 00:13:56,850 --> 00:13:53,889 psychic acts and so forth I've seen over 334 00:13:58,530 --> 00:13:56,860 the last past ten years or so these days 335 00:14:00,689 --> 00:13:58,540 it doesn't seem like anyone's got any 336 00:14:02,639 --> 00:14:00,699 imagination left the Victorians did it 337 00:14:05,280 --> 00:14:02,649 wonderfully well with sleights and 338 00:14:06,840 --> 00:14:05,290 invisible cloaks and cupboards and dark 339 00:14:09,630 --> 00:14:06,850 rooms and all sorts of things the 340 00:14:10,980 --> 00:14:09,640 modern-day so-called psychic just sort 341 00:14:12,660 --> 00:14:10,990 of stands up with a microphone in front 342 00:14:14,720 --> 00:14:12,670 of an audience and they don't have to be 343 00:14:17,579 --> 00:14:14,730 very good I think we've lost something I 344 00:14:21,180 --> 00:14:17,589 think so as well um modern-day psychics 345 00:14:22,920 --> 00:14:21,190 are disappointingly boring with the 346 00:14:24,569 --> 00:14:22,930 exception of mr. Geller of course who is 347 00:14:26,880 --> 00:14:24,579 one of the few interesting ones who are 348 00:14:28,470 --> 00:14:26,890 still on the circuit yeah I guess he 349 00:14:31,380 --> 00:14:28,480 doesn't play the top with the dead no 350 00:14:34,130 --> 00:14:31,390 that's summon yeah at least I sighs his 351 00:14:37,290 --> 00:14:34,140 claims a little bit less sad 352 00:14:39,059 --> 00:14:37,300 otherworldly I guess now I see that they 353 00:14:40,889 --> 00:14:39,069 said the beginner's guide to psychic 354 00:14:42,329 --> 00:14:40,899 trickery you've got a target here to 355 00:14:44,550 --> 00:14:42,339 help you sort of along with the the 356 00:14:47,309 --> 00:14:44,560 whole project of 300 pounds how can 357 00:14:49,620 --> 00:14:47,319 people help out um well the easiest way 358 00:14:51,930 --> 00:14:49,630 to help out is if you go to the psychic 359 00:14:54,750 --> 00:14:51,940 trickery website which is psychic 360 00:14:56,759 --> 00:14:54,760 trickery coda UK the top left there are 361 00:14:59,879 --> 00:14:56,769 two donation options one of them is 362 00:15:02,880 --> 00:14:59,889 crowdfunder which runs out on july the 363 00:15:04,980 --> 00:15:02,890 eleventh so I'm trying to trying to 364 00:15:05,610 --> 00:15:04,990 promote that one but underneath there is 365 00:15:07,170 --> 00:15:05,620 also a paper 366 00:15:09,720 --> 00:15:07,180 options so people can donate through 367 00:15:12,180 --> 00:15:09,730 either of those methods fantastic will I 368 00:15:13,620 --> 00:15:12,190 encourage everybody in Scotland and any 369 00:15:15,180 --> 00:15:13,630 interest people to have a look at that 370 00:15:17,340 --> 00:15:15,190 website and see what you're up to and 371 00:15:19,829 --> 00:15:17,350 finally and I really wish I could 372 00:15:23,670 --> 00:15:19,839 teleport over the two to end before this 373 00:15:27,210 --> 00:15:23,680 one ghosts busted on Friday the sixth of 374 00:15:29,340 --> 00:15:27,220 July can you tell me about that yes so 375 00:15:31,079 --> 00:15:29,350 there's there's Ghostbuster dom fried of 376 00:15:33,740 --> 00:15:31,089 the sixth and it's also running during 377 00:15:36,210 --> 00:15:33,750 the fringe as well on august seventeenth 378 00:15:39,090 --> 00:15:36,220 Ghostbuster is is really what helped 379 00:15:40,829 --> 00:15:39,100 kickstart edameh skeptics it's what I 380 00:15:42,420 --> 00:15:40,839 was working on when I was working with 381 00:15:44,280 --> 00:15:42,430 the ghost tour when I started to become 382 00:15:46,230 --> 00:15:44,290 more skeptical I started to realize that 383 00:15:48,630 --> 00:15:46,240 there was much more interesting 384 00:15:51,450 --> 00:15:48,640 explanations then dead person coming 385 00:15:54,390 --> 00:15:51,460 back to life and so I started developing 386 00:15:56,220 --> 00:15:54,400 this skeptical Ghost Walk of Edinburgh 387 00:15:57,870 --> 00:15:56,230 so we take people around Edinburgh we 388 00:15:59,790 --> 00:15:57,880 tell them the usual ghost stories but we 389 00:16:01,200 --> 00:15:59,800 then going to a little bit more detail 390 00:16:02,700 --> 00:16:01,210 and a little bit more explanation about 391 00:16:05,130 --> 00:16:02,710 what actually might be causing the 392 00:16:07,290 --> 00:16:05,140 phenomena and also there have been some 393 00:16:08,850 --> 00:16:07,300 legitimate investigations into alleged 394 00:16:11,340 --> 00:16:08,860 paranormal claims here in Edinburgh for 395 00:16:13,170 --> 00:16:11,350 example Richard Wiseman investigated the 396 00:16:14,579 --> 00:16:13,180 Southbridge volts which are here in Adam 397 00:16:16,860 --> 00:16:14,589 weather part of what's known as the 398 00:16:18,720 --> 00:16:16,870 underground city which not really City 399 00:16:20,070 --> 00:16:18,730 and only some of its underground but 400 00:16:22,130 --> 00:16:20,080 that's neither here nor there really 401 00:16:24,329 --> 00:16:22,140 it's just a nice tourist attraction and 402 00:16:26,010 --> 00:16:24,339 so he's investigated the alleged 403 00:16:27,870 --> 00:16:26,020 paranormal activity there so we explain 404 00:16:29,850 --> 00:16:27,880 exactly what he discovered and what he 405 00:16:33,269 --> 00:16:29,860 found out and we also look at things 406 00:16:35,100 --> 00:16:33,279 like EVP and parrot earlier and explains 407 00:16:38,699 --> 00:16:35,110 people exactly what might be causing the 408 00:16:40,500 --> 00:16:38,709 supernatural and paranormal goings-on so 409 00:16:42,750 --> 00:16:40,510 yes that take people around the city 410 00:16:45,180 --> 00:16:42,760 july the six is the first one that's 411 00:16:47,519 --> 00:16:45,190 open to the public and i see that's only 412 00:16:50,130 --> 00:16:47,529 five pounds what a bargain what a 413 00:16:51,750 --> 00:16:50,140 bargain indeed in fact i was as i was 414 00:16:53,670 --> 00:16:51,760 mentioning before i was in scotland only 415 00:16:55,920 --> 00:16:53,680 a few months ago in edinburgh what a 416 00:16:59,070 --> 00:16:55,930 lovely seated it is it's just so full of 417 00:17:02,100 --> 00:16:59,080 history and old wonderful buildings it's 418 00:17:03,240 --> 00:17:02,110 a great city for walking around I can't 419 00:17:04,949 --> 00:17:03,250 get enough of Edinburgh when you're 420 00:17:07,770 --> 00:17:04,959 walking around it it's just fantastic oh 421 00:17:09,120 --> 00:17:07,780 absolutely Edinburgh is a wonderful 422 00:17:10,740 --> 00:17:09,130 walking City which explains why there 423 00:17:13,350 --> 00:17:10,750 are so many tours of the city not just 424 00:17:14,730 --> 00:17:13,360 ghost tours or regular history tours as 425 00:17:16,230 --> 00:17:14,740 well suddenly they they don't seem to 426 00:17:17,260 --> 00:17:16,240 get as much attention as a ghost walks 427 00:17:19,120 --> 00:17:17,270 but 428 00:17:22,090 --> 00:17:19,130 is an absolutely stunning city and I I 429 00:17:23,710 --> 00:17:22,100 first visited it about six years ago and 430 00:17:26,140 --> 00:17:23,720 I fell in love with the with the place I 431 00:17:27,790 --> 00:17:26,150 moved up a year later and you're quite 432 00:17:30,550 --> 00:17:27,800 right it is a very very easy to walk 433 00:17:31,990 --> 00:17:30,560 city it's very very self-contained in 434 00:17:33,910 --> 00:17:32,000 fact for most of its history is only a 435 00:17:36,820 --> 00:17:33,920 mile by a quarter mile wide its only in 436 00:17:38,980 --> 00:17:36,830 the past 150 200 years it started to 437 00:17:41,800 --> 00:17:38,990 expand beyond that but it is aptly 438 00:17:43,990 --> 00:17:41,810 stunning and absolutely beautiful it 439 00:17:47,110 --> 00:17:44,000 certainly is and please give my regards 440 00:17:50,560 --> 00:17:47,120 to chris french and richard wiseman when 441 00:17:52,030 --> 00:17:50,570 you see them that's max testing and so 442 00:17:53,680 --> 00:17:52,040 there's the word people people in 443 00:17:55,930 --> 00:17:53,690 Scotland you know what to do head along 444 00:17:59,380 --> 00:17:55,940 to skeptics in the pub and please check 445 00:18:04,060 --> 00:17:59,390 out the website of ash price w WH price 446 00:18:06,130 --> 00:18:04,070 p ry CEO UK find out about the magic 447 00:18:08,350 --> 00:18:06,140 find out about the other things he does 448 00:18:11,680 --> 00:18:08,360 like performing arts public speaking and 449 00:18:14,260 --> 00:18:11,690 the wonderful walking ghost tours ghost 450 00:18:27,210 --> 00:18:14,270 busted ash price a pleasure to talk with 451 00:18:33,190 --> 00:18:30,070 the skeptic magazine the journal from 452 00:18:35,409 --> 00:18:33,200 Australian skeptics subscribe online to 453 00:18:39,999 --> 00:18:35,419 the world's second oldest skeptical 454 00:18:43,330 --> 00:18:40,009 magazine visit w WC apx calm day you and 455 00:18:46,930 --> 00:18:43,340 click the publication's league you can 456 00:18:50,259 --> 00:18:46,940 also find their over 30 years on back 457 00:18:59,139 --> 00:18:50,269 issues free to download the skeptic 458 00:19:04,419 --> 00:18:59,149 magazine from Australian skeptics the 459 00:19:07,690 --> 00:19:04,429 dirty disbelievers episode 9 don't harsh 460 00:19:10,480 --> 00:19:07,700 my mellow man yes dr. H in Richard 461 00:19:12,690 --> 00:19:10,490 Saunders attend a new-age fair and rude 462 00:19:16,149 --> 00:19:12,700 words fly you know the being called 463 00:19:18,340 --> 00:19:16,159 clever is not always a good thing the 464 00:19:21,460 --> 00:19:18,350 pity disbelievers 9 and dirty 465 00:19:26,350 --> 00:19:21,470 disbelievers calm Manor calmed are you 466 00:19:26,360 --> 00:19:45,270 ya gharchi deceive us 467 00:19:57,020 --> 00:19:48,060 is penny Chen 468 00:20:01,680 --> 00:19:59,640 the independent investigations group 469 00:20:04,470 --> 00:20:01,690 test fringe science claims in paranormal 470 00:20:05,730 --> 00:20:04,480 phenomena the group offers $50,000 to 471 00:20:08,250 --> 00:20:05,740 anyone who can prove they have 472 00:20:10,560 --> 00:20:08,260 supernatural powers or provide evidence 473 00:20:12,210 --> 00:20:10,570 of supernatural occurrence a nationwide 474 00:20:14,730 --> 00:20:12,220 volunteer organization based in 475 00:20:17,010 --> 00:20:14,740 Hollywood the iig Southern California 476 00:20:19,140 --> 00:20:17,020 branch has tested 26 claims since its 477 00:20:21,150 --> 00:20:19,150 creation in two thousand last week 478 00:20:23,250 --> 00:20:21,160 investigator Wendy Hughes talked with me 479 00:20:24,810 --> 00:20:23,260 about their most recent claimant and his 480 00:20:26,880 --> 00:20:24,820 subsequent demonstration while 481 00:20:28,799 --> 00:20:26,890 ultimately unsuccessful the lead-up 482 00:20:30,390 --> 00:20:28,809 showed examples of common problems and 483 00:20:37,860 --> 00:20:30,400 surprises faced by the group while 484 00:20:41,100 --> 00:20:37,870 planning demonstrations this is penny 485 00:20:47,299 --> 00:20:41,110 and I'm here in studio city with Wendy 486 00:20:51,480 --> 00:20:47,309 Hughes hi and Paula lauder bahay kampala 487 00:20:54,870 --> 00:20:51,490 so um on Sunday the tenth of June there 488 00:20:58,260 --> 00:20:54,880 was a what would you call it a pre was 489 00:21:01,890 --> 00:20:58,270 it a pre challenge for the iig the iig 490 00:21:04,740 --> 00:21:01,900 has a fifty-thousand-dollar paranormal 491 00:21:07,169 --> 00:21:04,750 challenge um I should say it's similar 492 00:21:10,260 --> 00:21:07,179 to Randy's million-dollar challenge and 493 00:21:13,020 --> 00:21:10,270 our group is grassroots skepticism group 494 00:21:14,970 --> 00:21:13,030 and if we can engage these people in 495 00:21:18,500 --> 00:21:14,980 correspondence and get them to fill in 496 00:21:22,020 --> 00:21:18,510 an application then we work out a 497 00:21:25,049 --> 00:21:22,030 protocol with them for a test of their 498 00:21:27,899 --> 00:21:25,059 paranormal claim you know the 499 00:21:30,299 --> 00:21:27,909 demonstration demonstration and the 500 00:21:34,289 --> 00:21:30,309 preliminary demonstration for one of 501 00:21:37,049 --> 00:21:34,299 these people took place on Sunday and if 502 00:21:40,380 --> 00:21:37,059 they pass that there's agreement about 503 00:21:42,600 --> 00:21:40,390 what constitutes passing and failure if 504 00:21:47,100 --> 00:21:42,610 they pass that then they would be 505 00:21:50,669 --> 00:21:47,110 qualified to a plenitude to for the 506 00:21:53,580 --> 00:21:50,679 $50,000 challenge which we would we've 507 00:21:55,110 --> 00:21:53,590 never gotten that far nobody has ever 508 00:21:58,500 --> 00:21:55,120 passed the preliminary challenge the 509 00:22:00,920 --> 00:21:58,510 demos always have a lot easier odds but 510 00:22:03,650 --> 00:22:00,930 um this is a claim 511 00:22:07,960 --> 00:22:03,660 claimant that came to us and it was a 512 00:22:12,760 --> 00:22:07,970 little different he sent us a series of 513 00:22:15,170 --> 00:22:12,770 photos and videos one of them was a 514 00:22:18,710 --> 00:22:15,180 photo or video that he took with his 515 00:22:20,120 --> 00:22:18,720 cell phone and it just looked like a you 516 00:22:22,490 --> 00:22:20,130 know he was taking a walk you could hear 517 00:22:25,370 --> 00:22:22,500 the footsteps and he was taking a walk 518 00:22:28,160 --> 00:22:25,380 down a residential street and he said 519 00:22:31,970 --> 00:22:28,170 that there was a bicycle with no rider 520 00:22:35,090 --> 00:22:31,980 peddling down the street and we couldn't 521 00:22:37,640 --> 00:22:35,100 see it and he sent us a picture of that 522 00:22:40,190 --> 00:22:37,650 um you couldn't tell what it was I mean 523 00:22:42,200 --> 00:22:40,200 it will it you literally couldn't tell 524 00:22:43,730 --> 00:22:42,210 what the picture was up but he said it 525 00:22:45,680 --> 00:22:43,740 was the interior of his car and there 526 00:22:48,890 --> 00:22:45,690 was an alien sitting in the seat next to 527 00:22:52,730 --> 00:22:48,900 him ah and we couldn't see that either 528 00:22:55,010 --> 00:22:52,740 and ice the first email I said was we 529 00:22:58,100 --> 00:22:55,020 can't see what you say is on there but 530 00:23:00,380 --> 00:22:58,110 you know if you if you want to make you 531 00:23:02,600 --> 00:23:00,390 know if you claim if you make a claim a 532 00:23:04,850 --> 00:23:02,610 paranormal claim that is something that 533 00:23:06,830 --> 00:23:04,860 is testable well you should have at 534 00:23:09,470 --> 00:23:06,840 least asked him if the alien was wearing 535 00:23:13,130 --> 00:23:09,480 a seatbelt because that's very important 536 00:23:17,390 --> 00:23:13,140 it didn't hurt that didn't hurt is he 537 00:23:22,550 --> 00:23:17,400 being a skeptic not something to cross 538 00:23:23,930 --> 00:23:22,560 my mother we share his responses with 539 00:23:26,360 --> 00:23:23,940 that whole committee and then like when 540 00:23:29,990 --> 00:23:26,370 he would write back to me if there's a 541 00:23:33,820 --> 00:23:30,000 part of me that that just wants to keep 542 00:23:35,870 --> 00:23:33,830 trying to advance the communication I 543 00:23:40,000 --> 00:23:35,880 don't want to ridicule any of these 544 00:23:44,660 --> 00:23:40,010 people yeah because what if what if 545 00:23:49,280 --> 00:23:44,670 someday someone tries to correspond with 546 00:23:54,440 --> 00:23:49,290 us who really can do telepathy who maybe 547 00:23:57,500 --> 00:23:54,450 is a you know like the next iteration of 548 00:24:00,890 --> 00:23:57,510 almost you know like a like x-men you 549 00:24:03,440 --> 00:24:00,900 know they use data or something I mean 550 00:24:05,810 --> 00:24:03,450 like that hasn't happened yet so how did 551 00:24:09,620 --> 00:24:05,820 you so this fellow with these weird 552 00:24:11,810 --> 00:24:09,630 pictures is who you tested on Sunday so 553 00:24:13,790 --> 00:24:11,820 how how did that what what what did you 554 00:24:14,210 --> 00:24:13,800 do how did you test him well first of 555 00:24:19,520 --> 00:24:14,220 all we 556 00:24:22,789 --> 00:24:19,530 to establish a claim that was going to 557 00:24:25,909 --> 00:24:22,799 be testable one of his proposed tests 558 00:24:27,350 --> 00:24:25,919 was that he could identify hidden you 559 00:24:30,230 --> 00:24:27,360 know hidden objects whether they were 560 00:24:33,350 --> 00:24:30,240 animal vegetable or mineral and then 561 00:24:35,480 --> 00:24:33,360 between us on the on the first 562 00:24:39,380 --> 00:24:35,490 responders committee we're going well 563 00:24:43,159 --> 00:24:39,390 actually a you know a cardboard box is 564 00:24:45,169 --> 00:24:43,169 vegetable and if we put a you're always 565 00:24:47,419 --> 00:24:45,179 thinking well yeah what if we put a fish 566 00:24:50,450 --> 00:24:47,429 you know gold fish in a fishbowl inside 567 00:24:52,970 --> 00:24:50,460 a cardboard box that would be the animal 568 00:24:55,520 --> 00:24:52,980 and then somebody pointed out that the 569 00:24:58,820 --> 00:24:55,530 glass is made of mineral of the fish 570 00:25:01,190 --> 00:24:58,830 ball and that the box was made of you 571 00:25:05,930 --> 00:25:01,200 know Pest put a dead fish inside how 572 00:25:08,930 --> 00:25:05,940 about that we have to negotiate among 573 00:25:11,419 --> 00:25:08,940 ourselves even to before we respond 574 00:25:14,289 --> 00:25:11,429 doesn't employ spend all this time doing 575 00:25:16,310 --> 00:25:14,299 this negotiations between ourselves 576 00:25:18,520 --> 00:25:16,320 meanwhile he would send another email 577 00:25:21,260 --> 00:25:18,530 with a totally unrelated test that he a 578 00:25:24,770 --> 00:25:21,270 other ability wait till one this seems 579 00:25:27,590 --> 00:25:24,780 unrelated to the alien photo in his car 580 00:25:30,140 --> 00:25:27,600 and the Bison it is amazing it is okay 581 00:25:32,510 --> 00:25:30,150 I'm just like insurance the same guy oh 582 00:25:35,240 --> 00:25:32,520 yeah and paula was pointing out he 583 00:25:36,770 --> 00:25:35,250 changes his claim with every email and 584 00:25:40,549 --> 00:25:36,780 so what were the next clay v's that he 585 00:25:43,490 --> 00:25:40,559 had um he started to make some claims 586 00:25:46,549 --> 00:25:43,500 that we could figure out and sending his 587 00:25:49,760 --> 00:25:46,559 videos which was interesting because he 588 00:25:53,720 --> 00:25:49,770 is very tech savvy he's not stupid he 589 00:25:57,169 --> 00:25:53,730 just has a belief system that's 590 00:26:00,080 --> 00:25:57,179 different from ours and that he if he 591 00:26:02,090 --> 00:26:00,090 could show us something that we've never 592 00:26:04,970 --> 00:26:02,100 seen before would be interested in 593 00:26:07,520 --> 00:26:04,980 seeing that and that's why we do these 594 00:26:11,690 --> 00:26:07,530 tests over and over again so one of the 595 00:26:14,450 --> 00:26:11,700 one of his um the video that's actually 596 00:26:17,060 --> 00:26:14,460 online right now is of him with these 597 00:26:18,560 --> 00:26:17,070 little like travel when you travel you 598 00:26:20,600 --> 00:26:18,570 want to take your own soap with you 599 00:26:24,480 --> 00:26:20,610 sometimes and gave a little transit 600 00:26:25,919 --> 00:26:24,490 redbox yeah and um so you had 601 00:26:28,290 --> 00:26:25,929 three different ones in three different 602 00:26:33,140 --> 00:26:28,300 colors and then he had these little 603 00:26:37,230 --> 00:26:33,150 religious charms faith hope and love and 604 00:26:39,630 --> 00:26:37,240 he could put the one charm in each box 605 00:26:41,310 --> 00:26:39,640 then shuffle around the boxes and claim 606 00:26:45,750 --> 00:26:41,320 to have forgotten which was which and 607 00:26:48,360 --> 00:26:45,760 then and then picked the box that had 608 00:26:51,510 --> 00:26:48,370 and then open them and so he sent us a 609 00:26:56,700 --> 00:26:51,520 video of himself doing that our chairman 610 00:26:59,520 --> 00:26:56,710 Jim under down um said but he switched 611 00:27:02,820 --> 00:26:59,530 his claim when he when he was opening 612 00:27:05,610 --> 00:27:02,830 the boxes he said that the faith one was 613 00:27:08,160 --> 00:27:05,620 going to be in the red box and the hope 614 00:27:11,040 --> 00:27:08,170 one in the yellow box and the loved one 615 00:27:13,350 --> 00:27:11,050 and the blue box and he switched that as 616 00:27:17,549 --> 00:27:13,360 he was opening the boxes and showing us 617 00:27:19,680 --> 00:27:17,559 which charm and we're going okay and so 618 00:27:22,830 --> 00:27:19,690 I had to write back to him and tell him 619 00:27:24,840 --> 00:27:22,840 the truth that we noticed that there was 620 00:27:26,970 --> 00:27:24,850 something wrong with how he was 621 00:27:28,620 --> 00:27:26,980 presenting his ability he didn't 622 00:27:32,460 --> 00:27:28,630 understand the concept either of a 623 00:27:34,799 --> 00:27:32,470 double-blind test in any sort he when he 624 00:27:37,860 --> 00:27:34,809 was filming this he had his own iPhone 625 00:27:40,110 --> 00:27:37,870 or whatever camera shooting it well as 626 00:27:41,760 --> 00:27:40,120 other hand was doing all the work with 627 00:27:44,390 --> 00:27:41,770 putting stuff in the boxes and mixing 628 00:27:47,280 --> 00:27:44,400 them up so he was the only one present 629 00:27:51,740 --> 00:27:47,290 and also we'll each of the charms has a 630 00:27:54,600 --> 00:27:51,750 different colored box yes which is not 631 00:27:57,299 --> 00:27:54,610 exactly hiding things from you selfie 632 00:27:59,820 --> 00:27:57,309 just so then we just started negotiating 633 00:28:03,900 --> 00:27:59,830 a test you know I'm saying ok well send 634 00:28:08,070 --> 00:28:03,910 us pictures of celebrities and he was 635 00:28:11,640 --> 00:28:08,080 able to pick pictures out of these kind 636 00:28:14,460 --> 00:28:11,650 of boxes the bankers boxes did he had 637 00:28:17,669 --> 00:28:14,470 assembled and he had photographs of 638 00:28:20,460 --> 00:28:17,679 movie stars from from movie magazines 639 00:28:22,080 --> 00:28:20,470 inside one of them was Tom Cruise and 640 00:28:23,940 --> 00:28:22,090 one of them was a picture of a movie 641 00:28:26,700 --> 00:28:23,950 magazine that had several movie stars on 642 00:28:27,830 --> 00:28:26,710 the front and I forget what was 643 00:28:30,560 --> 00:28:27,840 interesting is when he did 644 00:28:32,330 --> 00:28:30,570 similar test the picture of Amy 645 00:28:34,190 --> 00:28:32,340 Winehouse he said he couldn't read it's 646 00:28:35,810 --> 00:28:34,200 like some of these pictures had 647 00:28:38,210 --> 00:28:35,820 additional qualities to him so he would 648 00:28:41,210 --> 00:28:38,220 not be unable to read some celebrity 649 00:28:45,909 --> 00:28:41,220 pictures so that doesn't it took place 650 00:28:48,769 --> 00:28:45,919 on on sunday was a derivation of that 651 00:28:53,169 --> 00:28:48,779 protocol that he proposed because 652 00:28:56,720 --> 00:28:53,179 instead of using boxes we proposed 653 00:29:00,010 --> 00:28:56,730 envelopes so it was just less of a 654 00:29:02,830 --> 00:29:00,020 hassle and actually he had sent us a 655 00:29:06,139 --> 00:29:02,840 pictures pictures of himself picking 656 00:29:08,419 --> 00:29:06,149 pictures of presidents out of boxes in 657 00:29:11,779 --> 00:29:08,429 correctly guessing which presidents were 658 00:29:14,389 --> 00:29:11,789 which boxes and then by the time we got 659 00:29:19,120 --> 00:29:14,399 down to the test it wasn't presidents 660 00:29:21,730 --> 00:29:19,130 anymore it was other pictures of pop pop 661 00:29:27,260 --> 00:29:21,740 culture mixed martial artist fighter 662 00:29:29,899 --> 00:29:27,270 jets Lincoln Memorial and the star star 663 00:29:32,450 --> 00:29:29,909 wars star wars character we wanted him 664 00:29:34,250 --> 00:29:32,460 to choose the images so he could say I'm 665 00:29:36,950 --> 00:29:34,260 comfortable with all these images so he 666 00:29:38,870 --> 00:29:36,960 can't use that later as part of a reason 667 00:29:40,460 --> 00:29:38,880 why he didn't do well yeah so he proved 668 00:29:43,039 --> 00:29:40,470 all these engine it had to be something 669 00:29:45,230 --> 00:29:43,049 that he was familiar with is that what 670 00:29:47,630 --> 00:29:45,240 you're yeah okay all right yeah and then 671 00:29:50,360 --> 00:29:47,640 also I think is when we were planning 672 00:29:54,380 --> 00:29:50,370 our paranormal challenge preliminary 673 00:29:56,419 --> 00:29:54,390 tests and we we plan the test so that 674 00:30:00,110 --> 00:29:56,429 there is so that the test is 675 00:30:02,450 --> 00:30:00,120 double-blind so that satisfies us the 676 00:30:04,340 --> 00:30:02,460 fact that the claimant has been a part 677 00:30:06,340 --> 00:30:04,350 of the design of the test makes it fair 678 00:30:12,620 --> 00:30:06,350 to them and then what happened was 679 00:30:16,549 --> 00:30:12,630 strangely by coincidence and I mean I'm 680 00:30:23,509 --> 00:30:16,559 becoming an extra because of the odds 681 00:30:29,460 --> 00:30:23,519 must be crazy plugs be crazy calm right 682 00:30:32,639 --> 00:30:29,470 and all three trials he picked the 683 00:30:37,470 --> 00:30:32,649 Lincoln Memorial picture correctly 684 00:30:40,860 --> 00:30:37,480 correct well and it was just coincidence 685 00:30:44,610 --> 00:30:40,870 uh-huh there was no significance he had 686 00:30:46,769 --> 00:30:44,620 eat they were it was just one of those 687 00:30:48,450 --> 00:30:46,779 things were in Jarrett and I were widely 688 00:30:51,000 --> 00:30:48,460 we could have made the test would be 689 00:30:53,430 --> 00:30:51,010 difficult for any hits to have combat we 690 00:30:55,590 --> 00:30:53,440 it wasn't required for the odds but we 691 00:30:57,180 --> 00:30:55,600 could have done it if we wanted to but 692 00:31:00,960 --> 00:30:57,190 this still worked out because it would 693 00:31:02,759 --> 00:31:00,970 still be over 13,000 one against that he 694 00:31:05,220 --> 00:31:02,769 would get the hundred percent okay 695 00:31:07,230 --> 00:31:05,230 correct but he had the chance of getting 696 00:31:08,700 --> 00:31:07,240 hits like the Abraham Lincoln the 697 00:31:10,350 --> 00:31:08,710 difference with this one I think was 698 00:31:13,669 --> 00:31:10,360 that we've learned the lessons from 699 00:31:17,330 --> 00:31:13,679 previous trials from previous 700 00:31:20,909 --> 00:31:17,340 experiences and avoided some pitfalls 701 00:31:23,970 --> 00:31:20,919 ran into some brand new unexpected one 702 00:31:27,570 --> 00:31:23,980 having something I bet it's always it to 703 00:31:29,700 --> 00:31:27,580 me interestingly try it too we are 704 00:31:32,879 --> 00:31:29,710 interested in learning what makes these 705 00:31:34,889 --> 00:31:32,889 people tick uh-huh what you know what 706 00:31:37,379 --> 00:31:34,899 they're just is unique and so we learn 707 00:31:39,779 --> 00:31:37,389 from each test yeah that's interesting 708 00:31:41,610 --> 00:31:39,789 it is kind of like a scientific process 709 00:31:43,740 --> 00:31:41,620 you know it's good you learn with it 710 00:31:46,350 --> 00:31:43,750 with each one things you never expected 711 00:31:49,440 --> 00:31:46,360 to learn and when you stream it to our 712 00:31:51,060 --> 00:31:49,450 new affiliates and so those that haven't 713 00:31:54,090 --> 00:31:51,070 conducted their own tests yet they get a 714 00:31:56,850 --> 00:31:54,100 better idea what to expect okay so we're 715 00:31:58,799 --> 00:31:56,860 hoping to help other people that want to 716 00:32:02,250 --> 00:31:58,809 do this as well that's good that's cool 717 00:32:05,220 --> 00:32:02,260 well wendy and Paula thank you so much 718 00:32:08,850 --> 00:32:05,230 for talking with me today thank you 719 00:32:10,710 --> 00:32:08,860 petty thank you very much for full 720 00:32:12,590 --> 00:32:10,720 details on this and all previous 721 00:32:15,840 --> 00:32:12,600 investigations check out their website 722 00:32:18,389 --> 00:32:15,850 IIT wescom and look for them at the 723 00:32:20,310 --> 00:32:18,399 upcoming amazing meeting with the 724 00:32:30,740 --> 00:32:20,320 skeptical scoop this is penny signing 725 00:32:35,190 --> 00:32:33,090 hello Richard son is here with a little 726 00:32:38,160 --> 00:32:35,200 bit of information for those people 727 00:32:41,010 --> 00:32:38,170 living in the Bay Area the San Francisco 728 00:32:43,169 --> 00:32:41,020 Bay Area I'm going to be speaking about 729 00:32:46,350 --> 00:32:43,179 my adventures with the power balance 730 00:32:51,090 --> 00:32:46,360 wristband at a special event hosted by 731 00:32:55,260 --> 00:32:51,100 the Bay Area skeptics 7 p.m. wednesday 732 00:32:57,419 --> 00:32:55,270 the 11th of july at LaPenta lounge which 733 00:33:00,210 --> 00:32:57,429 is according to the information i am 734 00:33:02,669 --> 00:33:00,220 seeing a six minute stroll from ashby 735 00:33:10,310 --> 00:33:02,679 bart station now you can find out more 736 00:33:14,669 --> 00:33:10,320 details by visiting w WB a skeptics org 737 00:33:17,370 --> 00:33:14,679 also if you visit www scripting zone TV 738 00:33:22,169 --> 00:33:17,380 you can bid on an autographed photograph 739 00:33:26,340 --> 00:33:22,179 of the think tank crew myself iran sir 740 00:33:29,850 --> 00:33:26,350 give joanne bender mu stefan sojka dr. 741 00:33:32,370 --> 00:33:29,860 HC dunlop and maynard also included in 742 00:33:37,190 --> 00:33:32,380 that auction is an autographed copy of 743 00:33:39,659 --> 00:33:37,200 maynards book Maynard's and guide today 744 00:33:41,130 --> 00:33:39,669 hey you skeptics I have something to 745 00:33:43,350 --> 00:33:41,140 share with you I've got something that's 746 00:33:44,549 --> 00:33:43,360 going to get all you soft dicks to stop 747 00:33:47,460 --> 00:33:44,559 ignoring the truth that's right in front 748 00:33:49,020 --> 00:33:47,470 of your faces this is an EVP I recorded 749 00:33:51,659 --> 00:33:49,030 last night there was no one else around 750 00:33:53,909 --> 00:33:51,669 no other electronic equipment no other 751 00:33:59,320 --> 00:33:53,919 explanation this was a voice from beyond 752 00:33:59,330 --> 00:34:10,760 is your it here let me slow it down 753 00:34:26,580 --> 00:34:23,820 even slower slower how you doing I'm a 754 00:34:29,250 --> 00:34:26,590 ghost I'm unfinished business what's up 755 00:34:31,940 --> 00:34:29,260 you guys can't possibly ignore that type 756 00:34:34,710 --> 00:34:31,950 of it hey who are you pleated doing my 757 00:34:37,740 --> 00:34:34,720 hey gang I'm sorry but there are no 758 00:34:39,300 --> 00:34:37,750 spirits trying to contact you EVPs are 759 00:34:41,310 --> 00:34:39,310 the result of pareidolia and cross 760 00:34:44,910 --> 00:34:41,320 modulation combined with the listeners 761 00:34:46,830 --> 00:34:44,920 hopes and expectations and since when 762 00:34:48,900 --> 00:34:46,840 the hell do you use the unknown to the 763 00:34:53,750 --> 00:34:48,910 unknown what does this have to do with 764 00:35:02,130 --> 00:34:53,760 science you just got skeptical phone 765 00:35:17,700 --> 00:35:05,340 skip to creep own shop where false 766 00:35:22,930 --> 00:35:20,349 thank you for listening to the skeptics 767 00:35:24,490 --> 00:35:22,940 own now quick correction on last week's 768 00:35:28,839 --> 00:35:24,500 episode where we had a special guest 769 00:35:31,540 --> 00:35:28,849 reporter Aaron Stevens from California 770 00:35:33,250 --> 00:35:31,550 from Vacaville I said he was teaching at 771 00:35:35,620 --> 00:35:33,260 Vacaville high school that's not quite 772 00:35:38,260 --> 00:35:35,630 true he's actually at the crosstown high 773 00:35:41,470 --> 00:35:38,270 school which is will c wood high school 774 00:35:43,930 --> 00:35:41,480 in vacaville oh well I'm sure they're 775 00:35:46,270 --> 00:35:43,940 both great high schools not long to go 776 00:35:48,700 --> 00:35:46,280 now before the amazing meeting in Las 777 00:35:50,290 --> 00:35:48,710 Vegas and if you're going along please 778 00:35:53,710 --> 00:35:50,300 make sure you come up and say hi to me 779 00:35:55,780 --> 00:35:53,720 dr. Richie Iran so give and may not who 780 00:35:59,890 --> 00:35:55,790 will be there running around having lots 781 00:36:02,740 --> 00:35:59,900 of fun at tam in Las Vegas but for now 782 00:36:05,620 --> 00:36:02,750 on this crisp winter's day this is 783 00:36:11,680 --> 00:36:05,630 Richard Saunders signing off from Sydney 784 00:36:16,359 --> 00:36:11,690 Australia you've been listening to the 785 00:36:20,200 --> 00:36:16,369 skeptic zone visit our website at www